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	Comments on: (More Than) A Penny Saved is a Penny Wasted, In Which I Trivialize the Entire Industry of Financial Planning	</title>
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		<title>
		By: Get rich and die tryin&#8217; (to spend it) &#171; Marc Gawley		</title>
		<link>/savings/#comment-172579</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Get rich and die tryin&#8217; (to spend it) &#171; Marc Gawley]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Aug 2012 00:07:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=1494#comment-172579</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[[...] once you have all that money, then paraphrasing from an article at messymatters.com on [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] once you have all that money, then paraphrasing from an article at messymatters.com on [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>
		By: Arthur B.		</title>
		<link>/savings/#comment-109840</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Arthur B.]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Oct 2011 20:20:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=1494#comment-109840</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[@dreeves

Correct, but there&#039;s a one line argument :)
Your expected payoff should be 0, so p*100 + (1-p)*0 = 7 =&#062; p = 7/100]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@dreeves</p>
<p>Correct, but there&#8217;s a one line argument :)<br />
Your expected payoff should be 0, so p*100 + (1-p)*0 = 7 =&gt; p = 7/100</p>
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		<title>
		By: dreeves		</title>
		<link>/savings/#comment-86904</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[dreeves]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Sep 2011 15:38:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=1494#comment-86904</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[@Johnny, you mean leaving money for your heirs? I&#039;m advocating factoring that in to your target net worth.

@Arthur, Mathematica is telling me the answer is 7/100. http://dreev.es/rsolve]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Johnny, you mean leaving money for your heirs? I&#8217;m advocating factoring that in to your target net worth.</p>
<p>@Arthur, Mathematica is telling me the answer is 7/100. <a href="http://dreev.es/rsolve" rel="nofollow ugc">http://dreev.es/rsolve</a></p>
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		<title>
		By: Johnny Abacus		</title>
		<link>/savings/#comment-86796</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Johnny Abacus]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Sep 2011 08:29:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=1494#comment-86796</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[dreeves:

Do you differentiate between saving towards a bequest versus over saving without such an end in mind?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>dreeves:</p>
<p>Do you differentiate between saving towards a bequest versus over saving without such an end in mind?</p>
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		<title>
		By: Arthur B.		</title>
		<link>/savings/#comment-85591</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Arthur B.]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Sep 2011 13:13:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=1494#comment-85591</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[How about this puzzle. Every day you flip a coin. Heads, you win $1, tails you lose $1. Starting with $7, what is the probability that you&#039;ll reach $100 *before* going broke?]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How about this puzzle. Every day you flip a coin. Heads, you win $1, tails you lose $1. Starting with $7, what is the probability that you&#8217;ll reach $100 *before* going broke?</p>
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		<title>
		By: dreeves		</title>
		<link>/savings/#comment-85450</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[dreeves]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Sep 2011 03:29:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=1494#comment-85450</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[@Arthur, point taken! In my defense, I did include this sentence: For most people, no Golden Brick Road is necessary to tell them the glaringly obvious: they should be spending less.

And I see that one person so far claims in the straw poll there that I convinced them to save *more*. :)]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Arthur, point taken! In my defense, I did include this sentence: For most people, no Golden Brick Road is necessary to tell them the glaringly obvious: they should be spending less.</p>
<p>And I see that one person so far claims in the straw poll there that I convinced them to save *more*. :)</p>
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		<title>
		By: Arthur B.		</title>
		<link>/savings/#comment-85406</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Arthur B.]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Sep 2011 23:56:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=1494#comment-85406</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[Yes, the singularity might come and save us (or annihilate us), but this argument backfires.

If a positive singularity indeed occurs in the next couple decades, then the fraction of your life you spent saving too much money will be infinitesimal compared to the astronomical lifespan you will enjoy. Similarly, the loss of utility would be trivial compared to the wealth you would enjoy.

So &quot;the singularity is near&quot; argument implies that maybe your savings won&#039;t matter, but it also implies that in that not saving doesn&#039;t matter much either. The singularity makes everything moot.

Singularitarian arguments aside, I don&#039;t think people in the US suffer from too much savings. If anything, the saving rate in the US is one of the lowest in the world. This means you&#039;re living in a country where people heavily discount the future, which should give you a strong incentive to save (though manipulation of the interest rate complicates matters).

Sure, there is such a thing as saving too much, but compare the US&#039;s meager 5% saving rate to Singapore&#039;s 50%. It&#039;s much more likely US citizens save too little.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, the singularity might come and save us (or annihilate us), but this argument backfires.</p>
<p>If a positive singularity indeed occurs in the next couple decades, then the fraction of your life you spent saving too much money will be infinitesimal compared to the astronomical lifespan you will enjoy. Similarly, the loss of utility would be trivial compared to the wealth you would enjoy.</p>
<p>So &#8220;the singularity is near&#8221; argument implies that maybe your savings won&#8217;t matter, but it also implies that in that not saving doesn&#8217;t matter much either. The singularity makes everything moot.</p>
<p>Singularitarian arguments aside, I don&#8217;t think people in the US suffer from too much savings. If anything, the saving rate in the US is one of the lowest in the world. This means you&#8217;re living in a country where people heavily discount the future, which should give you a strong incentive to save (though manipulation of the interest rate complicates matters).</p>
<p>Sure, there is such a thing as saving too much, but compare the US&#8217;s meager 5% saving rate to Singapore&#8217;s 50%. It&#8217;s much more likely US citizens save too little.</p>
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		<title>
		By: dreeves		</title>
		<link>/savings/#comment-85391</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[dreeves]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Sep 2011 22:46:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=1494#comment-85391</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[@Arthur, nice work! (I just dug your solution out of the spam box; sorry about that!)

@Manoel, thanks! That&#039;s really nice to hear!

As to the bonus puzzle, I think Arthur has nailed it again. It&#039;s not true that you&#039;ll always go broke. If the random walk is biased towards saving then you might never go broke. The probability depends on how biased the random walk is. If the walk is biased in the other direction (towards spending) then you&#039;re right that you&#039;ll definitely eventually go broke.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Arthur, nice work! (I just dug your solution out of the spam box; sorry about that!)</p>
<p>@Manoel, thanks! That&#8217;s really nice to hear!</p>
<p>As to the bonus puzzle, I think Arthur has nailed it again. It&#8217;s not true that you&#8217;ll always go broke. If the random walk is biased towards saving then you might never go broke. The probability depends on how biased the random walk is. If the walk is biased in the other direction (towards spending) then you&#8217;re right that you&#8217;ll definitely eventually go broke.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Manoel Galdino		</title>
		<link>/savings/#comment-85358</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Manoel Galdino]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Sep 2011 20:41:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=1494#comment-85358</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I don&#039;t think its obvious. I&#039;m close to the option is a rationalization. But it&#039;s better. It makes my thoughts about the subject more clear to myself. 

And the bonus puzzle is the classical random walking class example (gambler&#039;s ruin). It&#039;s pretty obvius that with p = 50% or higher, the person will go broke. 

In fact, I think this was one of the questions in a test I take in a stochastic process class. But I can&#039;t remember the answer to the general case for any value of p.

But I guess that you will go broke for sure for any value of p higher than zero. That&#039;s because no matter how unlikley, there will be a sequence of spendings that will make you spend all of your money. More formally, denoting a spending event as success, and the amount of money you have at time t by k, the probability of k  success after time t (with no failure) approachs 1 as time goes to infinity.]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think its obvious. I&#8217;m close to the option is a rationalization. But it&#8217;s better. It makes my thoughts about the subject more clear to myself. </p>
<p>And the bonus puzzle is the classical random walking class example (gambler&#8217;s ruin). It&#8217;s pretty obvius that with p = 50% or higher, the person will go broke. </p>
<p>In fact, I think this was one of the questions in a test I take in a stochastic process class. But I can&#8217;t remember the answer to the general case for any value of p.</p>
<p>But I guess that you will go broke for sure for any value of p higher than zero. That&#8217;s because no matter how unlikley, there will be a sequence of spendings that will make you spend all of your money. More formally, denoting a spending event as success, and the amount of money you have at time t by k, the probability of k  success after time t (with no failure) approachs 1 as time goes to infinity.</p>
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		<title>
		By: Arthur B.		</title>
		<link>/savings/#comment-85355</link>

		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Arthur B.]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Sep 2011 20:36:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">/?p=1494#comment-85355</guid>

					<description><![CDATA[I posted my solution encoded so that it wouldn&#039;t spoil the problem, but I think these messages have been dropped by the spam filter :-/

I pasted the solution here
http://paste.ubuntu.com/680100/]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I posted my solution encoded so that it wouldn&#8217;t spoil the problem, but I think these messages have been dropped by the spam filter :-/</p>
<p>I pasted the solution here<br />
<a href="http://paste.ubuntu.com/680100/" rel="nofollow ugc">http://paste.ubuntu.com/680100/</a></p>
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